Lawsuit challenges N.C. Lottery

Comment #22

nc6string — Wed, 02 May 2007 13:53:16 GMT

The voluntary nature of a lottery ticket purchase may not determine it's status, but saying something is effectively a tax doesn't make it a tax either. There are many ways to raise reveune and fill state coffers which are not taxes. The state of North Carolina can tax a lottery ticket. They can meet in Raleigh and vote to tax lottery tickets like they tax other products. They haven't done so.

Governments these days are much more into fees. They don't like to be in the press for supporti... [ More ]

Comment #21

KY Floyd — Wed, 02 May 2007 06:42:03 GMT

The (questionable) right to pursue happiness doesn't mean you're also free of any obligation that might result. Earning enough that you have to pay taxes is completely voluntary, and it is that simple. If you want to avoid income tax you have the legal right to do so by not earning enough. Only if you choose to earn enough, will you have to pay income tax. Property tax, and taxes on alcohol, cigarettes and gasoline are other things that result in an obligation to pay a tax, but only if you choo... [ More ]

Comment #20

Drivedabizness — Tue, 01 May 2007 22:39:25 GMT

Not that a Court can't find its way to reach just about any concusion, BUT

This argument has been around as long as the lottery industry has been around.

By definition, a tax is something you must pay, or you face some sort of government sanction or force. An earlier comment said that if you don't want to pay a tax, avoid that action or behavior. That's a little too simplistic...there is a difference between things like income and property taxes where the right to seek wealth and property... [ More ]

Comment #19

nc6string — Tue, 01 May 2007 11:58:08 GMT

Ha Ha - I don't like it that much

Comment #18

tnlotto1 — Tue, 01 May 2007 00:47:12 GMT

you can always drive to tennessee or south carolina if they take away your powerball...

Comment #17

justxploring — Tue, 01 May 2007 00:14:57 GMT

Clever analysis! Except, of course, the lottery makes no promises to its players. Enron cheated people out of money they put aside for retirement.

Comment #16

nc6string — Mon, 30 Apr 2007 23:35:41 GMT

All I know is I have 3 weeks to hit Powerball. Let 'er rip

Comment #15

KY Floyd — Mon, 30 Apr 2007 17:24:15 GMT

Usually it's a lot more like an Enron 401k. Over time you put in a lot of money and finally end up with nothing.

Comment #14

KY Floyd — Mon, 30 Apr 2007 16:59:45 GMT

Whether or not other people pay it has nothing to do with whether or not it's tax. There are all sorts of taxes that only tax some of the people. Nobody expects people who don't own property to pay their fair share of property taxes, and nobody expects people who don't smoke or drink to send in tax payments for the cigarettes and alcohol they didn't buy. Contrary to popular opinion, all taxes are voluntary. If you don't want to pay a particular tax just don't meet the requirements for paying t... [ More ]

Comment #13

KY Floyd — Mon, 30 Apr 2007 16:39:52 GMT

They aren't using the god argument, because it has nothing to do with the legality of the law. Even if God himself drops by and says he doesn't like lotteries and all the players, retailers and employees of the lottery commission are going to hell, the Constitution still gives us some protection from his followers who want to force their beliefs on the rest of us.

Of course anyone with a lick of sense knows that their real complaint is based on religious beliefs. They're only using the tax... [ More ]

Comment #12

DoubleDown — Mon, 30 Apr 2007 16:32:52 GMT

Oh, Dear, don't you know that's just a way the State gets more taxes from the poor?

I have people tell me that the lottery is the redneck 401- K ... same thing I guess.

Comment #11

KY Floyd — Mon, 30 Apr 2007 16:31:33 GMT

The case itself can't affect other states, but bluenoses in other states can use the same tactic. If any other state has different requirements for enacting taxes and their lottery bills didn't meet those requirements, then those laws could be overturned if the courts rule that the lottery is a tax. Such a ruling in NC would offer precedent, but it wouldn't be binding on any other state. The plaintiffs could use it to bolster their argument, but courts in other states would be free to ignore it.... [ More ]

Comment #10

justxploring — Mon, 30 Apr 2007 16:19:18 GMT

Yup, there's property tax, sales tax, gas tax, etc. Look at your cell phone bill and your home phone, internet or cable bill and the communications tax is very high. (never can figure out all those surcharges!) Depending on where you live, if you buy a home and you don't have any children, you still have to pay the same property tax for education as someone with 4 kids in school. That's why I think a lottery is very important to a state as long as they are really giving the money to educatio... [ More ]

Comment #9

jarasan — Mon, 30 Apr 2007 13:28:29 GMT

I guarantee you the people bringing forth this lawsuit have nothing better to do. Busy bodies, trying to dictate what others do, they should mind their own business.

Comment #8

guesser — Mon, 30 Apr 2007 11:25:54 GMT

We are aware of that, and it's going to get a lot worse.

KyMystikal: the difference between a donation and a tax is a donation is not automatically tacked onto your purchase, and a tax is.

Go to an event where you have to 'donate' to get in ? If you don't want to donate, they have to let you in, if they force you to donate, then, I guess you call the lawyers or the police, because then it's not a 'donation', it's a 'fee'. The difference being if it's a 'fee', then THEY have to col... [ More ]

Comment #7

nc6string — Mon, 30 Apr 2007 11:10:37 GMT

Double and triple taxation happens all the time already.

Example, when you earn money you pay your income tax. Now whatever already taxed dollars remain are spent at the store, where you then pay sales tax. Pretty much the government winds up with everything! Good thing is everyone knows governments spend too much so they throw all that money back into the economy.

Comment #6

KyMystikal — Mon, 30 Apr 2007 06:37:12 GMT

I agree with what both of you said. Maybe they will change it to the way TN has it where there is no tax on lottery winnings from the state. That is the main reason why I now play Powerball in TN instead of KY. I also didn't see why those groups were complaining because if it is considered a tax, it is a volunteer tax. I'm sure somewhere in the advertising for the NC lottery games it says that proceeds benefit the education system, so you can call it a tax if you want or a donation. If it could... [ More ]

Comment #5

guesser — Mon, 30 Apr 2007 04:35:09 GMT

I'm wondering about a correlation between: if it is a 'tax', then how can they tax winnings ? Isn't that double-taxation ?

If they have already collected a 'tax' when you purchase a ticket, how can they tax you (again) when money is going back out ? (Income tax).

And if it is not a 'tax', again, how can they tax it when money goes back out ?

Think of a life insurance payoff - it's not taxed as income, or anything else.. but the insurance companies pay a tax every time you make an insu... [ More ]

Comment #4

rdc137 — Mon, 30 Apr 2007 02:00:56 GMT

I'm surprised they didn't use the God argument. I'm actually surprised that NC has a lottery, and I believe it will be short lived. Look back at the article about how the community shunned the $800,000 Powerball winner. NC's mentality cannot handle a lottery. I have a funny feeling that VA, TN, GA, and SC will soon see increased ticket sales from NC buyers.

Comment #3

Littleoldlady — Sun, 29 Apr 2007 23:03:15 GMT

No way is it a tax. Playing the lottery is done of one's own free will and is not a tax . I expect if the state runs a business such as the lottery, it should be able to make a profit. If it was a tax, then for the people who don't play the lottery..how do they pay their fair share? Tax some of the people? NOT! It fits the description of a business! A business is allowed to make a profit! Nut Jobs! They are making the wrong argument.

Comment #2

Todd — Sun, 29 Apr 2007 22:45:21 GMT

Very good point

Comment #1

tnlotto1 — Sun, 29 Apr 2007 21:48:29 GMT

i wonder if this case can affect other state lotteries or just north carolina?i wouldnt want any states i visit to lose the lottery...

Lawsuit challenges N.C. Lottery

Lottery Post — Sun, 29 Apr 2007 21:20:11 GMT

Plaintiffs say the lottery is a tax because of the education allocation and was passed unconstitutionally

An esoteric argument under way in the courts over the North Carolina lottery Is a part of each ticket a tax or is the state just making a profit? could have an effect that's easy to understand: No more lottery. The N.C. Court of Appeals will hear arguments in three weeks.

The case is pushed by a nonprofit legal group that sees the lottery as a tax that didn't go through the req... [ More ]